US stock · Technology sector · Software—Infrastructure
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Block, Inc.

SQNYSE

83.83

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50.136BMarket CAP
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I feel like that depends on location. $3K a month in much of the south east can be rather cushy if living within one's means. But going off of what I experienced living in Northern California for a couple years, in an area a lot cheaper than San Diego... $3K p/m doesn't go very far... We literally rented a converted storage shed under 450 sq ft to keep our rent and utilities under $1K and be able to have our dog. And even still, we paid nearly $750 p/m for rent and col was high... Where I'm from on the east coast, that would have rented a decent small house or a nice apartment at the time. And even now, $3k would cover our mortgage, utilities and basic necessities with a little left over. But I can't imagine how tight things would be living on $3K a month in San Diego...

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No they don’t. The people obsessed with Sh0rt SqUeEzEs are Stimmy Traders who haven’t bought anything other than a meme stock prior to 2021.

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It’s a 2000 sq ft house, we keep it around 72 and have a heat pump. We’re on 1.5 acres, but we use our well to water the lawn (water’s not potable but it’s fine for gardening). We don’t even use public sewage - we’re on septic. I’ve “analyzed” my electric bill and it’s all over the place. I think it costs more where I live, but the rest is a huge mystery to me.

Our new house is way smaller, so hopefully that’s a step in the right direction.

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https://airtable.com/shrqYt5kSqMzHV9R5/tbl8c8kanuNB6bPYr?backgroundColor=green&viewControls=on sort by date descending.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonyounger/2020/04/12/update-on-tech-start-up-layoffs-what-where-who-and-the-impact-on-freelancers/?sh=2b0b35d24514 >Tech jobs have been lost all over the country, and across a variety of sectors. And, one obvious area that has recently been hard hit is the startup community in the Bay Area and elsewhere.

Now the big boys are joining in.

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I've said it for quite some time, but I wouldn't touch SQ with a ten-foot pole.

Glad history has vindicated me on that (at least so far).

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Also, remember to use house value and not land value. I have a 1500 sq ft house in California that has a total property value of about 1MM, there is no way it's going to average 50-100k/yr in maintenance unless I'm bulldozing it and rebuilding.

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I bought ark at all time high $144 something. SQ at $240. Buy high sell low

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In theory maybe, but it seems half of them in my area just sit empty and the ancient little 900sq ft 2 bedroom up the street that was only $1800 to rent last year is now on the market for $3000/ month.

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ShOrT SqUeEzE

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Snap net and sq all pumping stupid. What the fuck changed about the market? Nothing.

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Then perhaps you aren't seeing the people who never make six figures who FIRE. Focus on those people, focus on the podcasts and blogs and books that show how 'average' people get to FI. What's the most important aspect of getting to FI? Is it income, or expenses, or the relative delta between? Is it having a spouse on the same page; is it where one choses to live or how? Is it starting at 30 rather than 45? Is it how you invest, or in what? Because I know plenty of my neighbors with 6+figure salaries that will NEVER see FI. They see their McMansion and all the pretty furnishings and ego-rides in their driveway, and Doordash/dominos on the counter every night, and the 'stuff' that they purchase making a half-dozen pages of their CC statement, or is that just the interest on debt they never seem to pay off? Boy, they sure look like they have it made, except for the hair loss and bags under their eyes and how every vaca to Tahoe or Tahiti seems to leave them more tired than when they left. Up to their eyebrows in American Dream debt. But maybe that's just me, tapping on a 2015 Mac with a 2007 Chevy in the drive in a home with 'only' 2100 sq ft and no mortgage, who'd rather hike in the woods than hit the $200/person steak house this afternoon. So ... maybe you feel fucked, but boy would I like to introduce you to my 'rich' neighbors. Pretty sure once you get to know them, you'll feel lucky.

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Spend some time on /r/sandiego, /r/sandiegan, r/Moving2SanDiego/ and some of the smaller regional subs for the area. If you're not in a position to buy, spend even more time reading through all the horror posts about trying to rent here. It's brutal - see the thread today about someone's rent going up from 1.5k to 1.7k....for a 300sq ft studio.

SDGE (gas/elec utility) is practically criminal. You'll pay obscene amounts for gas and electricity. There are posts almost every day about people getting hit with bills that have more than doubled or tripled from a year ago. Electricity is going to be 83 cents per kWh this summer during peak hours, compared to 70 cents a year ago, and 59 cents two years ago.

Water rates continue to increase as drought gets worse and billions are pumped into projects to try and shore up the water supply. Water bills start at about 75/month for a single family home, we're paying almost triple what we paid in the midwest.

Look up grocery prices at Ralphs, Vons/Albertons, Stater Bros, and compare to what you're paying now. A $3 loaf of bread in the midwest is $4 here. $2.50 vs $3.75 for a gallon of milk. Eggs are insane everywhere now, but we could get a dozen eggs for a buck at Meijer, when we came here you couldn't find a dozen for under $2 (and now it's closer to $4-5, but that's everywhere).

That all being said, I don't regret our move here, but we were able to buy a home and are DINK software engineers who would be making somewhere around 350-400k combined if we were both working full time. You definitely want to do some research on how far 150-200k will get you with a baby. It's hella expensive.

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Where did you get 350sq ft?

Rhetorical question I'm guessing? But I'll humor you. Last I looked at land you can find an acre around here for $3,000-$14,000 depending on proximity to "the city". The houses I mentioned take up the majority of the lot they are built on so not even half an acre.

So I'll guesstimate at....... maybe $6k tops for land per house given the location? And that is, of course, if it wasn't their great grandpappy's land that nobody had anything to do with.

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  1. Luxury units at location A reduce Rent in location B. The economic incentive to build luxury is such that more units get made & then more low income units get vacated than building low income directly would.

This is because the margins are so much lower on low units that the risk is higher to investors & less building happens.

More units & filtering down is far better.

  1. Most luxury units are not luxury. The cost to build a 'low rent unit' vs a 'luxury' is a few dollars a sq ft. They have same crappy cabinets & LVP/carpet. It's marketing.

People associate new with luxury, so they will always advertise that.

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How about put a cap on how many privately owned rental houses one person is allowed to have.. my last neighborhood people from wealthy parts of the US were buying a fair chunk up and renting out for ridiculous money.. half my block was rentals before I sold my house!!(to a young couple not a corp or rental person).

I don’t think making ‘cheaper’ housing will make a difference because honestly? The difference between a 1700 sq ft ‘cheap’ house and a 1700 sq ft ‘expensive’ house is very very little.. maybe 10k dollars difference in materials. All houses are built to price these days but sold to very highly maximize profit.

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18 yrs old,looking to buy more growth stocks when the market is going to come down a bit

SOFI-36%

NVDA-18%

AMD 13.5%

SQ-7.7%

ADOBE-6.6%

AMAZON-6.19%

NIO-5.9%

FORTINET 5.6%

on my watch list: dis,googl,amzn,tesla,crwd,alto,ddog,shop,s,dkng

would love some input on the stocks! thank you

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18 yrs old,looking to buy more growth stocks when the market is going to come down a bit

SOFI-36%

NVDA-18%

AMD 13.5%

SQ-7.7%

ADOBE-6.6%

AMAZON-6.19%

NIO-5.9%

FORTINET 5.6%

on my watch list: dis,googl,amzn,tesla,crwd,alto,ddog,shop,s,dkng

would love some input on the stocks! thank you

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Geez. I have a 3200 sq ft house almost fully mortgaged and my expenses re less than yours. Your throwing money away. Too much car. Any extra dollar you have should go to pay off the car loan. 20% interest rate was their way of telling you that you can’t afford it, yet you bought anyway.

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That's a good idea. FWIW, I just opened a position in SQ this week! I think they're a great buy right now (though I prefer buying closer to 70)

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Because the previous supply is still around.

Prices will only go down however if building out paces increases in demand.

If you live in a city that is growing 2% a year, and there is a shortage by 10% in housing, you have to build at least 13% more units to lower prices.

If current rent for say a 600 Sq ft apartment is 1000 dollars, and a new 600 sqft one is built, but it's luxurious, and goes for 1200. The old apartment will either have to renovate to compete, or lower its price since the difference isn't so much that someone couldnt justify it.

But if the new 1200 are rented, and people who could afford 1000 or 1200 are still around wanting a place, the 1000 will still go up in price, as will the 1200.

However, if there were enough 1200 apartments built, that there were 1000 dollar apartments were not being rented. Then thier prices drop to get someone to rent.

No one wants to sit on unused property

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This is still an issue of local governance. If there are local regulations that require a two car garage, specific lot size, and a setback form the road of X distance, then the costs imposed justify jumping to a more expensive home right away.

In LA there used to be a requirement for 1-2 covered parking spaces with all new homes (depending on Sq ft). That came at an estimated cost of 20k-40k. It simply doesn't make sense to build a $200k home in that environment with 10% of the cost going to parking. Fortunately, LA killed the previously regulation, but it's representative of a broader issue with code and zoning.

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Yeah, I get it. Same situation where I'm talking. Literally 5 minutes away and you're in Grosse Point where things are selling for $500/sq ft and up. But that's not the reality in the neighborhood where the lots are so you'll never make those numbers work.

Ultimately, the market is telling you the value isn't there.

The best argument you could make is buying it in speculation that the area comes up enough to justify building. I've thought about it but just don't feel the rush to do so.

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What are homes on the street selling for?

I have a neighborhood in Detroit that I LOVE. I own 5 houses in it. It's a small footprint and there's a very wealthy community literally 2min away. There's a bunch of commercial development happening that's literally 2min walking distance from my houses.

I can buy a couple vacant lots, today, for $5k each. But I haven't because the cost to build leaves basically no money to be made when sold. At best I'd be able to sell for $300k... at BEST for a 1,500 sq ft house. And you're probably looking at $300/sq ft to build new construction.

Doesn't make sense.

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He's not wrong, though. San Franciscan here who saved up for twenty years to buy a 700sq ft condo. I could have bought a home here as early as 2013, actually, except while we were searching prices shot up 30%.

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Financed price per sq ft, true dollars, was mostly falling for decades (until recent rate hikes). Overall price remained fairly high because houses got so much bigger.

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It's not a problem of cost genius it's a problem of production.

How many watts does that much projected sq footage actually produce?

There's a fininte amount of throughput that a solar panel generates you neanderthal

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>I think her view was orthogonal to current debates.

Yes or no: have you read her books.

>But they built enough housing in those decades and since the 1970s house building has collapsed leading to increased housing prices. Housing prices were flat from 1890-1980...

They built sprawling and unsustainable suburbs that were only possible thanks to massive government subsidies.

>I think we have recreated racial Zoning based on pricing.

That's literally what I said, and it's in reference to single family housing, not historical buildings in urban cores.

>I've read some of it and while I agree on some elements like eyes on the street but development is good and that's my point.

No, development is development, it's value neutral stripped of context. The highways were development, they were bad. The housing subdivisions we're development; they're an anchor on municipal governments who can't afford to maintain the infrastructure on a lower per block density.

>I think we need to return to 1920s development style which was kinda before purely racist policies (no blacks can own property here) to zoning which gets around race via prices.

This is straight up a lie, racist development policies go back a long, long time. Shelley v Kramer finally overturned racial covenants, and their specific convenant dates back to 1911. Public housing projects (in this era, these were working class homes) were explicitly segregated.

> If the housing is 500k and up that means the amount of blacks are lower.

There's a whole lot more to it, including banks giving worse rates to "certain" customers and the increased price of a newly built unit vs an older unit.

Replacing old buildings with new ones doesn't materially change the amount of units in the area, especially as modern units are often larger as well. You're right that zoning needs to change; but it's primarily changing parking requirements and R1 regulations to allow duplexes and smaller lots in newer suburbs. The Painted Ladies are still in a neighborhood with 32,000 people per sq mile, the cities surrounding San Francisco but still "in the city" (Metro area) are barely cracking 12,000.

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In the bay area they're building 700-900sq ft condos with $400+ HOA's. Townhomes are common as well.

But you're right, starter stand alone homes in the area do look ridiculous. Everything is 2 story to maximize space and the house takes up 75% of the lot. Many homes don't have driveways/front yards. Just a strip of grass/greenery between the sidewalk and the house that the HOA takes care of. I take a bike path along a creek that goes behind some homes. It seems like I could almost touch the back fence from the back door.

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Great, Im glad that helps. Here are a few things I learned along the way.

  1. I am capable of doing alot of parts of a renovation. I can do flooring, fixtures, light framing, basic plumbing/electric, paint, trim, permits, buying materials.
  2. I will not pretend I am do the job of a framer, tiler, electrician, plumber, structural engineer. I will gladly pay someone to do the job correctly, up to code and in a short time. I cannot. 3, If I think a project will take 3 weeks, it will take 3 months. Realistically double whatever time you think you can do it .
  3. It will cost close to double of whatever I budget. Its the unknowns that really get you in building projects.
  4. Plan on literally hundreds of return visits to home depot or wherever you go for your supplies. Until you get better, you will always need some other tool, or screw or extra tubes of caulk or whatever. Dont even get me going on plumbing projects, always missing a part.
  5. Buy the tools you need (preferably not with heloc $$), for every different project you do. Buy good brands so you have them for a long time hopefully.
  6. Start saving all the extra building materials from your project and use them for the next one.
  7. Learn everything you will ever need to know from experienced neighbors and friends. Like all of us, they are usually happy to be asked and would be glad to give advice and/or come by and help out with the project ... and most importantly watch youtube, ridiculous amonts of learning from those videos!!
  8. If you remodel below grade , make sure you spend the money and time to deal with water intrusion and/or drainage . It is worth the $$, time delays, stress in the long term. That includes directing water in your gutters and downspouts away from the foundation. It makes a difference.
  9. Dont sacrifice spending time with family and friends just to work on a house project. Im a teacher with summers off, I spent almost an entire summer onenyear in the basement finishing the space. Missed out on important time with everyone, especially my kids only to have the basement flood months later and having to rip out much of the work I did over the summer. Trust me I have no issue ignoring my kids and doing my own thing, but I think with remodel projects, I just get so invested in finishing the damn thing that I neglect the important things at the moment. Your project is important and it will pay off in the long run, but time with your kids is more important and will pay of magnitudes more in the long term.

My magic number for finding a good residential property with potential for a another unit is $200/ sq ft. At that price , the mortgage numbers work in my favor (with my specific financial needs), and then I dont feel like Im teetering on financial ruin. Not really, but you get the idea. Be patient, dont rush, have confidence in your decisions, take advice, but dont compare yourself to others. The mist important thing to take away is that none of this shit matters, i could be dead tomorrow. Time with family and laughs and good times with friend, traveling, having a cold beer on a hot day is the legacy you will leave , not how many houses you bought, or your net worth, or your rental units. Happy to answer any more questions you have. Im no expert, make sure you do your own research and asking around. Good luck!!!

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I mean housing needs have changed the original suburban homes for a family of 2 with 3-4 kids was 1000 SQ ft.

I mean define starter home SQ ft because it seems like most want 1,600 on the low end before you get to condos.

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The problem is that no one builds "starter" homes anymore. They build all these massive 4-5 bedroom 3 bath 4000sq ft monsters that half the country can't afford while all the "starter" homes like 1-2 bed ranchers get demolished because they're 80 years old now.

Where are people supposed to start their families these days? Limited to apartment buildings in the big cities where all the drug dealers and criminals live.

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2310 sq ft is not almost 3000. But you're right, price per square foot is probably a better metric.

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Upgrade if that’s what you want. At the end of the day, you’ll be the one living in the space. I’d look at your building on Zillow to get an idea of what your neighbors have done if they updated. It’ll give you an insight into the level of upgrades.

I just redid my den. The painters re-surfaced the cabinet doors (turned 80s style cabinets into shaker) and added depth to a wraparound bar the size of an apartment kitchen. That was $2200 (including painting built-ins, a bar, and a wall papered 900sq ft room). Cabinet makers had quoted me $6000 for the doors alone! Remnant stones made the countertops a lot cheaper than originally quoted by the big box stores. Cabinet handles - got some gorgeous marble ones from TJ Maxx of all places for $10/8 pack. Everyone who’s come by has asked where I got them. The kitchen is next on my renovate list. I’m hoping for some good deals there too.

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Go online and see what similar houses worth 250k are renting for.. I like 1% rule, so that means a 250k house should rent for at least 2500 a month. In my area I also know that $1.25 a square ft. Is a healthy number to be at. So a 1,000 sq. Ft. House should be at least $1250, plus 100 for garage and 100 for basement. When multiple equations say I’ll make money, I’m comfortable. I’ve found my rules and comfortable numbers. I can assess a houses value to me in about a minute. Then it’s simply I make a call and buy or I don’t. Find your set of numbers for your area and trust them, not hype, or what your realtor tells you, or any of that junk.

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Ya, some areas cost more and as a result the wages are higher in those areas. With higher interest rates it is harder to buy right now for sure. For what its worth what I would recommend is save as much as possible and sacrifice now, the prices will come down because of the higher rates and the moment interest rates drop look into picking something up. Your timing will be good to buy low and finance low. With enough cash on hand, then you should be able to pick up something that you want. I put 300k down on my primary residence, fincanced the rest, ya it's 9000 sq ft, but I did it when rates were lower. Been here 10 years. My mortgage is paid by my rental properties that were all acquired before my primary. I would live in them and then buy another. There has to be sacrifice either on the front end of the back end. Those that sacrifice and save earlier in their life have a better mid life usually, those that spend all their money that they are making usually struggle to acquire assets early enough in their life that they think they are always struggling. I think values are too high personally, probably why I have 2 properties for sale now. 😉

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Houses in cities cost that. You can find 4000 sq foot houses for 200k if you are not in city.

And, it's real simple. If you think your problems are extraneous to you then you will never advance.

The US had a monopoly on production from 1945 through 1980, that will never happen again so get used to not having the same advantages as people born in 1946, 1966, etc.

People all around the world can't afford homes... if you have the wrong attitude you'll be one of them.

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The average size of a home was also about half of what it is today (1500 sq ft vs close to 3K today)

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There's a variety of factors besides the sq footage in the actual residence, and there is no definitive answer here.

When you rent, you are paying for the right to use the property. You will gain no equity, and you generally do not have any rights to modify, add, or remove. If you're renting an apartment you may not also have much, if any, land available for your use, especially your private use.

You also (generally) have no obligation to repair or maintain the property outside of basic upkeep such as cleaning and normal care.

The mortgage for a piece of property should be less than a hypothetically identical piece of property in an identical location. That said, real estate is also speculative in nature and part of what you're paying for when you buy is the future value of the home and/or potential profits of renting. It's also susceptible to normal supply and demand pressures and mortgage interest rates so that may not always be true.

Once you add the costs of maintenance, repairs, etc. the price should be higher initially, but will be cheaper over 30 years as rents rise and your mortgage remains the same. You will also have the benefit of equity and the generational wealth that creates.

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Can anyone offer or share any general insight about the economics of kitchen appliances/renovation and home value?

Context: I live in a diverse working class neighborhood in Chicago, and want to upgrade my kitchen for myself. It’s a two bedroom two bath (about 1300 sq fr) that’s plenty of space for me. It would be a bit tight for two people, and definitely tight for two people and a kid. So this building has a high turnover of residents - lots of young families live here while they are saving up for something bigger, while the long term residents tend to be single people.

Additionally, this is an old building from the 1920’s, and it’s very different (traditional, with hallways and separate rooms) from all the new construction and condos that are being built around here, which are all modern and open concept. I love this place for what it is and specifically bought it because it was different, but I don’t know how common that perspective is. I’m guessing the condo developers around here are investing in modern, gray, and open concept as a result of research they’ve done about the market.

My kitchen is fully functional but hasn’t been updated since the Bush administration. I love to cook and would like to upgrade for me in a traditional/transitional style. So I understand that I wouldn’t be getting back the full cost of the renovations when I sell. I also have no plans to sell soon, but that can change at any time.

That said, I also don’t want to go willy nilly and ramp up this kitchen to something that is not at all appropriate for this neighborhood and building. Especially if the upgrades I make are completely at odds with what potential buyers down the line would want. Plus, updating at least a little seems appropriate if I do want to sell in a few years, since it looks very dated.

Basically, I understand the upgrades are for me but if I can increase home value as much as I can while I’m at it, that would be great. And I definitely don’t want to do anything that decreases home value.

Any advice would be appreciated! Most of the advice I look for online is from people or industries that benefit from renovations, so I thought the people at r/personalfinance might have a better appproach :)

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Where we live in Colorado they raise rates in the winter months then lower it in the summer. We had an 800 sq ft apartment and paid $80-$100 a month for both gas and electric.

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In 1992 my Dad bought my childhood house for 45K. 2,200 sq foot with complete basement. We had just moved to the city from a rural area, and the land he sold was worth 25K. 50 acres with a house and barn on it with river front. 25k!! That shit is worth over 400K today.

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I got a permit to install temporary power service. They stonewalled me for 9 weeks. I finally got an old man who owns a structural steel outfit light into them to get the permit. I had taught his engineers autocad in the 90s. I left half of one old piece of decking on the roof so I could call it a repair. The whole town/county was stalking me during the dog remediation, it was a notorious dog hoarder property for 30 years and before that a beloved bar. They just hate me personally so I am not investing in the build out. I am just trying to turn them couple years of work I did into a safe place to write and have a garden. Its 4000 sq ft, 9 bedrooms with two 19th century mahogany bars in it. All cinderblock. Gorgeous place really, right on the OH/PA border. Same town that guy got caught putting the lead weights in them fish. On the road everyone takes to the lake. Great location. They just hate long haired homeless hippies I guess.

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Personally I wouldn’t pick either of your options, but maybe a combination of the two.

What about purchasing a 600-700K home and putting down 200K. Then you’ll have more monthly cash flow and feel more secure (I can’t imagine having a million dollar home and one spouse losing their job…). I also think you can compromise and find a nice car below the price of a G wagon. If you’re truly looking to blow 2-3K per month… spend it on traveling instead.

My husband and I make 250-300K and our 15 year mortgage PITI is 1600/month. We have one $600 car payment at 1.99% otherwise we’d pay it off. Our other vehicle is 10 years old. We have SO much flexibility in our lives with the disposable income leftover each month. We could absolutely afford to upgrade to a more expensive house, but we continue to live in our home because it’s 3 bedrooms, 2.5 bathrooms and nicely updated (plenty of room for our family of 3 and it’s only 1800sq feet). We are increasing our retirement savings rate and traveling A LOT. We buy ourselves nice items but stay away from adding recurring monthly payments. You may have different priorities and that’s fine, just sharing from a different perspective.

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Would you also take the average sq footage of family homes? 1100 sq feet for a family of 4? If you want all things to be the same, only look at the prices of those homes in 2022 in comparable areas…

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Did SQ say the n-word or what is going on?

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Really want to short SPOT to sub 70 but it has you-guys strength rn. Same with SQ

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You shot yourself in the foot.

Housing prices in Modesto:

2 bed: $250,000+ on average

Lol I managed to find a 1 bed just under 800 sq ft for $238,000

Rent: $1500+

The cheapest trailer I could find was like $50,000 holy fuck.

Dude, do you actually know anything about housing?

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Not necessarily, what exactly “zoned for agriculture or personal use” means and how difficult it is to rezone or get a variance varies greatly by locality. Many places will let you build a farm house on land you’re actively farming, and will let you get away with just planting an acre of Christmas trees and then building a 4,500 sq ft house with a 3 acre landscaped garden and in ground pool. Or they might grant you a variance to build a house if there hasn’t been any recent history of farming on the property. Or as you say, it might be impossible to build anything. But it it’s definitely worth pursuing to find out exactly what his options are.

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I have my billing through conservice as my apartment building requires it. Does it have all your utilities on the bill? Yours may be different but I realized that I'm not getting billed for my apartment, I'm getting billed for "my portion" of the building bill. Basically they split the bill between all the apartments and everyone pays the same price whether you have a 1 bedroom or a 3 bedroom. I'm also in a 1 bed/800 sq ft apartment and my bill is $45 this month and my heat is set at 65 and doesn't even come on. I live on an upper floor of a building that uses a hot water system for heating. I actually have windows open and its 40 degrees outside to cool my apartment off because the upper floors get so ridiculously hot even in winter.

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I have owned a 800 sq ft condo for 3 years all year round the bill is under $5.

EXCEPT for November and December when the bills is between $40-$65/month due to all day heating.

Natural gas prices have gone up

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Yes that is high, do you a gas furnace? Most appartments here use elec for stove, hotwater which also is used for heat. Some older boiler bldgs spreads the wealth across all tenants.

I average about $160 for a 2600 sq ft house with 6 people this time of year..

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$SQ puts

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Prices are already falling in certain markets. The majority of my local market is going for less/sq ft than the comps from 6+ months ago.

There's still a lot more correction needed, imo. It's going to be interesting over the coming months.

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Come to Jersey…1400sq ft house on maybe 1/4 acre - $12k a year

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Different people have different philosophies on this.

For example, I have a HELOC. I only use it to make improvements to the home itself, and improvements that create additional value. To get deeper: I do not use my HELOC to find routine maintenance or do a cosmetic project. But I am using my HELOC to find a larger project that is adding 600 SQ ft of legal dwelling space and a legal bedroom & bath. This addition, in our area, will increase the value of the home itself. I don't mind using my home's equity to increase its own value.

My dad on the other hand had a HELOC on his life his whole life, and used it for things like buying a vehicle. He worked in a high commission profession with large annual bonuses, and used the HELOC to say, buy a car, and then used large commission checks and bonuses to pay it down. If he went for a while without a large commission check, no problem, the interest-only payment during the draw period was tiny and he could direct the income he did have to regular expenses, and the HELOC afforded him some time to pay it back.

I didn't like my dad's strategy, personally. Most people here wouldn't either. But (anecdotally) it never but him in the ass. It worked for him just as he planned.

Personally, I only have it to do big projects to increase or protect the value of the house itself.

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Also important to note houses are now 150% larger than 1980. 1595 sq ft in 1980 to 2386 sq ft in 2018. That comes at a cost too. Median Home Size in US

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UPST and SQ. Fuck 'em

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I always find it funny how those rates sound crazy to US-based people. I'm from the Dominican Republic and there's not a single decent apartment under $120k (and that's for 1 bedroom ~645 sq. ft.); mortgage rates at about 14%. Personal loans going crazy at 24% though☠️☠️

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If the question is "how much space are we building for people to occupy?", it's the correct thing to ask. Your comment just explains why that might be happening - or at least a large part of it.

But it would also be worth noting dwelling size has increased and people use up more sq. ft.

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That size is fine- I quite like around 1000 sq ft. I'm talking more about the condition of the homes. Cheaply made or falling apart. It seems your options are new oversized construction in the suburbs or older homes in the city that will need a lot of repair. Obviously there is some in between but doesn't seem like much (which could just be a function of the extremes staying on the market).

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so we did upgrade the house and converted the sq footage, correct this is all on paper and based on the comp we had from our realtor based upon the sqfootage. The actual appraise value could be lower

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I'm sure most people would rather live in a nice 2500sq ft suburban house but you can't really build enough housing that way, and for sure not enough affordable housing. This also doesn't have to be an either or, some affordable dense housing units nearer freeways and central locations and more single housing on the outskirts of the cities.

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I wanted a 1000-1500 sq ft bungalow in an urban part of my city but developers are razing them in favor of larger homes on postage stamp sized lots

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Yeah I worked in RE before so I bought at my max despite people telling me not tok and my da telling me not to buy a townhouse bc they don’t appreciate as much.

Now he says he’s glad I bought when I did because my mortgage is $600 and HOA $300 so it’s $900+ utilities. My older sister (2 years old) just moved back in with parents bc her 1 bedroom at $1,700 was going up to $1,850+ utilities so she’s back home saving for a down payment.

We are shopping for SFHs now but are deciding to wait. In November 2020 we passed over making an offer of $325k on a house (3x1.5 1,100 sq ft, 8,000 lot) that would have had a PITI mortgage for $2,850 under the terms of 10% down ($32k) at a 6.5% interest rate.

With $400-$500 in utilities it would have been $3,250-$3,350 total monthly expense and that is 3x our housing expenses now.

We passed we could not justify the increase for simply 1 extra bedroom and 1 other bath and a backyard. When we looked at it it had been 100 days on market. That house just went pending yesterday after 150 days on the market

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$VetMe is a Newly launched token on the ERC-20 network.

https://twitter.com/OghenetejiriOk2/status/1617906561267171328?t=ByIjdwXf3sqXkm8HT0XJVQ&s=19

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The Capitol of CA. We are two hours from the SF Bay Area where SFHs are $1mil +

Townhome (2x1 900sq ft) I bought at $150k in 2020 (2.5% Interest rate) now has value of $250k.

Median SFH Sacramento is $610k. Starter homes (2x1s and 3x1) in 2020 where at $230k -$330k. Now you can not find anything -Not even a 2x1 in the hood for under $350k-$360k. The highly desirable neighborhood are $450k to $ 650k now.

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The costs are really dependent on your area (as real estate really is local). In So cal, most estimates I've heard is that even for MF, you would be looking at an extra $100 plus per sq/ft, and potentially more. In other states, permits and hookups could be 100k+ per property. What about dirt work and other soft costs? Does the $130/sq ft include a contingency amount? Are you doing the work or subbing it out (and how penciled in are you to the build numbers)? How are you financing it? And will they finance it for whatever your expected build time is?

While the lot may be zoned for MF, does the zoning support 5 units? And is there enough set backs, lot size, water run off items, etc for 5 units?

Any particular reason you aren't teaming up with someone with development experience?

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i bought sq at 62 and sold at 63 :)

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People want density with club owned amenities and then are shocked when the it's good from a public finance perspective, but more expensive per sq ft from an individual one.

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Blackrock sits on the biggest epicenter of commercial and consumer real estate in NA. It is not purely a real estate play, so it may survive the coming commercial apocalypse, but be sure when secondary cities like Seattle and San Francisco are watching commercial sq ft prices plummet under the lack of interest and pending lease expiries, it will not end well for REITs and Blackrock will be just behind them.

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Life is definitely better for most. Crime is down. Technology that was never dreamed about 30 years ago is affordable for everyone. You have a smartphone, tv, internet, access to wonderful food at stores and restaurants… life is much better now. Price per sq ft of a home is not the only measurement of quality of life.

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Even with old single pane windows in our 2500 sq ft home built in 1998, our maximum summer bill is usually around $250. At some point we'll upgrade the windows and get the roof foamed, which will increase efficiency by a lot.

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It depends on a lot of factors. My house note is $1350/month. That includes taxes and insurance. My house in 2600 sq/ft. on a 1/2 acre in a great neighborhood. Rent would be about twice that for a comparable home.

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What really drove me to finally buy was when we rented an apartment in a complex that was built in 2015, and it still had paper-thin walls, ceilings/floor sounded like bass drums when walking on them, had single-pane windows, and every unit had an inefficient condenser unit outside with an incredibly loud blower unit inside each apartment.

We were paying around $1200 a month for a 1 bedroom. We ended up getting a starter house with a mortgage payment of about $1190...and the electricity bill for the 1800 sq ft house was barely more expensive than it was for the 650 sq ft apartment.

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Never heard a truer statement. Can’t afford a hail Mary. SQ options are shit. My AAPL practice options printed $580. Might just stick with them. I really want a second player tho

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It's still an exaggeration. If you are using numbers from San Francisco, NYC, maybe but they have always been high anyway.

Here is an example of my point. I grew up in a small 2 bedroom house in a town of 30,000 people in North Carolina. In 1994 that house was worth $40k. Today it's worth $100k so it's gone up 250%. In 1994 I bought a small house in Seattle with 2 bedrooms, same yard size and a similar age to the house I grew up in. It cost $150k and today it's about $600k so it gone up 400%.

Mortgage rates in 1994 were a little over 8%. Pre-Covid (2019) rates were a little under 4%.

So it matters more where you live and what size house you are buying and how much interest you are paying.

Over time house sizes have gone way up, it's expensive to live in SF, NYC, Seattle and so some much is midsize cities. If you don't qualify for a job that is a higher paying job then it makes more sense for you to live in a smaller city. If you live in a higher expense area and money is tight, it makes more sense to live in an older and smaller house.

If your mortgage interest rate is half that of another era you would need to compare actual mortgage payments and then adjust for inflation rather than comparing listed prices since your interest payment would be double in the earlier era.

You can't compare a 1,000 sq ft house with a 2,200 sq ft house.

It also depends on what you consider an "average" blue collar salary and an "average" white collar salary. In a place like Seattle a majority of the white collar people are highly paid software engineers working for Amazon, Microsoft, and the same applies in San Francisco and in NYC it's highly paid hedge fund traders.

If two white collar employees are married then no one is paying 10 times their earnings especially for the kind of small houses that were in norm in the earlier era.

For most people is larger cities it's always seemed very expensive to buy a house and in smaller towns and cities it's always been more doable, never easy but more doable even with smaller salaries.

Go to Goldsboro, NC today and you can buy my childhood home for $100k. You could find one in Spokane today for $300k. People look at the price of a brand new, larger house in a great location/part of town and then come up the idea that prices are too high. No one wants a "starter" home today.

People's expectations have changed more than after interest mortgage payments adjusted for inflation.

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Can we kill sq

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Same boat as OP. I joined a SaaS startup in mid 2010s and got to witness cloud transformation’s boom. Bought into a lot of IPOs such as OKTA, MULE, SQ, ZEN, TWLO, etc. It was a pretty sweet 6yrs lol.

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On the other hand a SFH needs to deal with its own site prep, drainage, utility hookup, foundation, roof, exterior insulation/protection on all sides instead of 1 or 2, etc.

Not really convinced that a condo is more labor per SQ ft than SFH.

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Bro how low is your self esteem that u think giving money to college woman is not how u bang em

Go to Columbus sq park

They not jus my sitting there my Amigo there selling it bro and “ seeking arrangement “ is another one they use

All those girls have a “ tryst” link selling anoos to those men

Why u think u see em with older men all the time 🤣🤣🫡

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A 1500 sq ft condo is not one for one similar to a 1500 sq ft single family house; they aren't one for one. If there is common space, it counts toward the family's total quality of life. The house, on the other hand, may allow expansion.

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Yes, I get it. After they ruin our homes and don't pay rent, they head for the hills. I am going to try and sue the local people. It's just not fair. I give them a spotless, beautiful home, 2,000 sq.ft. and they try and hurt my home as much as possible. I've lowered rent, I've let them pay two payments a month...I do everything a landlord could do to help them. I can't keep eating their unpaid rent and damage to my home.

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Lol.. upper middle class genXer here who lives in a town full of 3000+ Sq ft mcmansions. This is pretty much the arrangement.

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>The electric bill for the 900 sq ft house was like $450 per month in July and August, and that was in 2009 when energy was pretty cheap.

People here in Oregon didn't believe me when I told them how much prices jumped after deregulation down there. a $450 a/c bill was just nuts, in 2001.

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It’s technology’s fault. Everything is much more complicated per sq ft compared historically. Homes built even 10 years ago are less sophisticated than the options available for today.

This is why it does have a positive impact on GDP btw. It’s a good thing.

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Thank you so much for the honest reply! We ran the numbers and it looks like the "salon suite" model is what's really taking off these days. To get top dollar and keep vacancy low we would want to renovate the space into little 100 sq ft suites. After running the numbers on all that construction cost we agree that it's likely too big of a pain. I think we will list the space and rent it out to a tenant with the stipulation that we cover some of the renovation costs to get it up to snuff.

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All great points. Also idk where OP lives but in a lot of HCOL areas rent is insanely high. For example where I live, if I wanted to live within 30 min of the city center I'd have to pay about $3,100 a month for a 550 sq ft studio apartment. The absolute cheapest apartments I can find are $1,700 about 1.5 hrs out from the city center and they are in the projects. These are basically slums where a single unit can hold 8-10 people that split the rent.

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The electric bill for the 900 sq ft house was like $450 per month in July and August, and that was in 2009 when energy was pretty cheap.

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AMD, Tesla, SQ is my portfolio and I’m ducking rich

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> You have time, markets are slow, and so is inventory nationwide

Not in my area!

I'm house shopping right now and out of 42 saved searches on Zillow that I've added within the last week, 30 of them have been snapped up. I'm seeing a lot of these houses sell in as little as 3-4 days. And they're not even well priced either, $400,000 for a 1000 sq ft townhome built in 1950 with minimal renovations done since then.

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It’s rarely code for “I have several hobbies and would benefit from additional space.” Most people don’t have hobbies that require giant homes.

If you walked from door to door in any generic American suburb, you’d be lucky to find 20% of homeowners who have hobbies that require an additional 1000+ sq feet of additional space just for their hobby.

Haha. I have hobbies. Most people have hobbies. My four major ones are cycling, wine, cooking, and travel. None of which require space, and are pretty common.

The idea that any significant number of people have hobbies that require 5000 sq feet of space is comical. Most hobbies that do require such space are niche. How many people do you honestly think restore antique cars or produce wine or whatever? It’s not the kind of numbers that necessitate so many millions of people living in giant houses.

I know what bookshelves do. I’ve been into dozens of homes that have bookshelves filled with decorative pieces and knick knacks.

And don’t focus on “bookshelves”. It can be anything — end tables, side tables, shelving, lights, decorative pieces, a random chair, whatever. People move into big homes “for more space” and then fill the newly spaces with all kinds of shit. All the time. Putting them back where they started.

If you don’t think that Americans buy and consume metric tons of unnecessary and useless shit, then you’re not paying attention to the world around you. It’s one of the things the Americans do best.

When people say they need more space, it often means they need less shit. That’s it.

I’m not trying in the slightest to suggest that nobody needs extra space, ever. But the vast majority of people absolutely do not. They think they do. We as a society think we do. And it’s all consumerism bullshit meant to pry you of you time and money. That’s it.

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I’m saying that most artists would prefer to have the music industry of 2000 over whatever shadow of its former self exists today. To 99.99% of artists there is no appreciable difference between the revenue derived from streaming and when listeners downloaded it for free from Limewire or Napster because the payout structure favours major labels and is a pittance anyway.

Yes, the proliferation of music software and gear has made making music more accessible but it’s still a significant investment for an artist or producer to build out a studio, $20,000-$100,000 is not unrealistic depending on the kind of music you want to produce. Sure, you can make bedroom pop on a laptop with a single microphone but if you want to make anything involving recorded instruments then you’ll need a acoustically treated space and special accommodations made to the electrical and heating/cooling in order to record commercially viable recordings. It’s not as simple as “we can record this in my buddy’s basement”, unfortunately.

Also, for an single/album to have the kind of polish and quality that listeners are accustomed to, a producer will have to spend hundreds of hours with the artist or band to accomplish that. All of this (should) cost money as the investment in all these facets is considerable.

I’ve dedicated the last 15 years of my life to working as a music producer/composer and I have built a 1,500 sq ft studio, so I know what goes into this all too well. I’ve seen business interests decimate the industry and then decimate it again.

Streaming subscribers think that they’re meaningfully contributing to music but in reality, they aren’t. I highly recommend listening to this podcast to bring yourself up to speed with the current state of the music industry

https://www.theverge.com/2023/1/17/23558679/taylor-swift-music-industry-streaming-spotify-eras-tour-midnights-ticketmaster

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Y the fuck does sq only go up

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I’m making $25,000 a year and live in a 400 sq ft apartment. I have no car and have to share a computer with my neighbor. I eat nothing but rice and potatoes. But fuck it, at least I don’t have student loans

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Financially-anxious friends, how in the world do you pull the trigger on buying a house? Especially if you live in a VHCOL housing market where you’ll never be able to afford your dream house and will need to compromise on something.

Husband and I have been casually going to open houses for about a year now and yesterday we saw a house that for the first time we could imagine pulling the trigger on. Friend who’s a real estate agent in the area confirmed it’s an amazing investment if we are okay with a small house (850 sq ft + ADU) on a huge lot (4750 sq ft) and building to our needs as our family grows.

Even though we can definitely afford it, are familiar with the area, and will have a pretty intense inspection contingency with any offer, the thought of actually committing makes me so scared!

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I'm just going to ask because I didn't see it mentioned, and your comment sounds like you ruled this out already.... Is moving and changing jobs possibly a wise long-term idea?

I live in the midwest (born and raised in St. Louis, Missouri and now across the river in Alton, Illinois). I relocated to the metro DC area (chose to live in Maryland) for a job change about 10-11 years ago. That was a really HCOL area but after renting a townhouse in a more rural area there for about 1 1/2 years, I started looking for a house to buy. I was still married at that point, so we were finally able to qualify for a house via a USDA loan (no money down necessary beyond some closing costs) using our combined incomes. We still wound up about 60-70 minutes away from my office (downtown Bethesda, MD), but it was a nice 2 story 2,200 sq. foot place for about $230,000.

Long story, but things changed (COVID and a divorce). Lost the job I moved out there for and really disliked the next one I took just to keep paying the bills. Sold the house (at a small profit, thankfully) and decided to move back to the midwest.

As soon as I moved back, I got 3 job interviews lined up and had 2 job offers in the first 2 weeks. (I was really worried about getting a new job ASAP when moving back but I think the "prestige" of working in that HCOL area actually helped me stand out on my resume.)

Point of my story is, I was able to buy a small house out here for only $42,000 or so and then spent probably about that much over the next 2 years fixing it all up. Now, it has new electrical, a new roof, a partially finished basement, new garage door and power opener on the detached garage, a rebuilt shed in the yard, new plumbing and a bathroom remodel. And all done relatively comfortably with my current job's pay. Reality was, the increased pay I got for living in the DC area didn't really offset all the higher expenses to live and commute out there. So you MIGHT do a lot better in a cheaper to live in part of the country.

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I would only consider this home and the necessary updates/repairs if you plan to stay in it for quite some time. I recently (within the last 3 years) had several of the listed items completed on my 1940 2000 sq ft home and here are the costs:

  1. Replace siding, gutters (it’s hard to salvage these when siding is replaced), and wrap all window trim and doors = $23,000

  2. Repair/replace top 3 feet of brick chimney and shoulders = $7500. This was the cheapest out of 3 bids. Lesson learned: chimney masons are expensive AF.

  3. Replace furnace and AC = $9500

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Unless you guys are skilled in DIY I agree with alot of the other comments. Spend another 100k and buy something in better condition. Homeownership is constant fixing and maintaining on top of the mortgage, taxes and utilities. I think alot of prospective buyers focus to much on the mortgage payment. I've already spent 4k on heating oil/pellets it's not even Feb yet. 1950s 1400sq ranch.

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Pulled the trigger on appl, sq and spy. You guys should probably jump ship now

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Buy the smallest/cheapest house in the best neighborhood you can afford. Real estate is a nice portal to building wealth.

Story time: 20 years ago I bought my house (new build) priced at $220k. I could’ve put down 20%, but the yard wasn’t in, basement not finished, etc. I ran the numbers and decided I could live with paying the PMI, so only put down about 10%. Put the other saved money into yard first. Needed to buy a lawnmower, weed eater, other misc. yard tools. After a couple of years, interest rates came down (I bought at 7.25% and felt like I was king of the world with that then-cheap rate). I refinanced when rates came down down and because the yard was in and maintained, got a higher appraisal. Refinanced with a cash-out loan ($30k out because equity) and finished the basement. More equity. Refinanced a third time when rates were stupid low, and didn’t have to worry about PMI. Now I have a home worth more than $700k.

But here’s an interesting side story: when I was looking for homes 20 years ago, I looked very seriously at an existing home priced at $286k, about $60k more than I wanted to spend, so I passed. That home had a huge lot (yard already in, finished basement, etc.) and curb appeal for days…and was about 1000 sq ft. larger. I wish I would have stretched a little to afford that extra $60k - that house, due to location, lot, etc. is now worth well over $1.5M.

Moral to the story: I would have a much higher net worth (on paper) than I do if I would have bitten the bullet and spent the extra $60k. I would’ve been stretched, but I could’ve made it work with side hustles, roomies, etc.

I used lots of words to say that I think you should take the leap. Stretch a little. Get the best house in the best location you can afford. I would have $1M in equity had I stretched just a little more.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda…

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$sq "ALL THESE LEVELS POSTED AHEAD OF TIME BEFORE THE MARKET OPENED https://t.co/1t1dyrFdzF
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$SQ (cashapp) long term
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Inflation and rates will be macro tailwinds for Block, says Baird analyst David Koning $SQ https://t.co/PESPk8CPkf
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